1 Finding Your Purpose as a Mom With Author and Podcaster, Courtney DeFeo

1. Finding Your Purpose as a Mom with Courtney DeFeo, Founder of Lil Light O’ Mine and Author of In This House We Will Giggle

 

**Transcription Below** 

 

2 Peter 1:5 (ESV) “For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge," 

 

Courtney DeFeo left her corporate career to work as a mom, homemaker, and business owner. She published a book In This House, We Will Giggle, among many other initiatives, such as speaking, podcasting, and running her business called “Lil Light O’ Mine”.  Courtney is now living in Dallas, TX with her husband Ron and their two wildly creative and sweet girls. 

At The Savvy Sauce, we will only recommend products we believe it! And we want you to be aware: We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.

 

Courtney’s Website

 

ABC Scripture Cards

 

Virtue Memory Cards

 

Leading Girls Podcast (Now Called Treasured)

 

Light ‘em up acts of kindness

 

Jeannie Cunnion Mom Set Free Book

 

Jeannie Cunnion Mom Set Free Bible Study

 

Thank You to Our Sponsor: Chick-fil-A East Peoria 

 

Connect with The Savvy Sauce on Facebook or Instagram or Our Website

 

Please help us out by sharing this episode with a friend, leaving a 5-star rating and review, and subscribing to this podcast!  

 

Gospel Scripture: (all NIV) 

 

Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,” 

 

Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.” 

 

Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.” 

 

Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.” 

 

Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” 

 

Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.” 

 

John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.” 

 

Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” 

 

Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.

 

Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus” 

 

Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession- to the praise of his glory.”  

 

Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.” 

 

Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“  

 

Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“ 

 

Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.”  

 

**Transcription** 

 

[00:00:00] <music> 

 

Laura Dugger: Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host, Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here. 

 

[00:00:17] <music>

Laura Dugger: Hey everyone, today we get to chat with Courtney DeFeo. After Courtney left her corporate job, she worked as a homemaker, mom, and also started her own business called Little Light of Mine. Her mission is to empower moms and change little lives through innovation in the home. 

Courtney also is a speaker and an author. Her book is called In This House, We Will Giggle. Courtney now lives in Dallas, Texas with her husband, Ron, and their two girls. I hope you enjoy our chat.

Today's message is brought to you by Chick-fil-A East Peoria. Stay tuned for insider tips we're going to share during the episode.

Laura Dugger: Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, Courtney.

Courtney DeFeo: Hello. I almost said "welcome". Welcome to you. Welcome to the conversation. 

Laura Dugger: Fantastic. For anybody who doesn't know you yet, can you give us a current snapshot of who you are and what you like to do?

Courtney DeFeo: Absolutely. Well, my name is Courtney DeFeo. You know, for most people, they don't know, unless you're a Spanish speaking person, DeFeo means "of ugly". I'd like to just throw that out there for anyone. I did not know until I married my husband. I mean, what a secret to be kept! So that's amazing. 

And raising two girls, and I have to tell them that. Imagine just saying, like, "No, you're beautiful, and your name means 'of ugly'." This is so random. But we have two girls. One is turning nine on Saturday, and the other is 11. It's Ella and Larson. 

We currently live in Texas, but I say currently because I just never know. My husband is a smarty pants, gets recruited all over. [00:02:00] He's currently doing a job for American Airlines. But I kind of just hold on to my seat. 

We grew up in Georgia, loved that state, and then we moved to Florida for four years and did the Disney thing around the clock, which was awesome. Now we're in Texas. 

I'm most excited about being a mom. I think I'm better as a mom that I'm a wife. The wife thing is harder work for me. I just naturally think of my kids all day. That's embarrassing to admit, but I really do have to 'poor thing', my poor husband. I'm like, "Oh, yeah you. On, yes. Oh, I forgot you." 

Laura Dugger: Well, you've learned a lot on your motherhood journey and I would just love for you to share a few of those lessons with us.

Courtney DeFeo: It is not easy to be a mom in this age of Pinterest and Instagram. I know everybody that comes on your podcast will probably say that, but it's true. You know, there's never been another time where you can open your phone and see mother's killing it. You're like, "Whoa! She has five kids and she's a size zero and she runs like four ministries and she's happy about it and she's running on her way." So it's just a hard time. 

I would just say don't be so hard on yourself because I am my worst critic. I'm looking at a picture right now in front of me of me holding my sweet little cutie, Larson, who was maybe two at the time. I was so critical of everything that I did. Every move that went wrong with them, I blamed myself. [00:03:25] 

I would just probably go back and enjoy it a little bit more, hold them a little bit longer, definitely play with them longer, and definitely not feel the pressure to change the world and fix everything.

So you'll feel that tension in the conversation we're about to have is that God did some neat things in the past seven years through my ministry, but my heartbeat at the end of the day is that these two girls know that they're loved, they know God, and that I've had some really intentional time being with them because it flies.

Laura Dugger: Let's start with somebody who's listening, maybe they're a new mom, how would you recommend they find their purpose as a mom?

Courtney DeFeo: When you have little kids, you can get in this rut of like, Is this Groundhog's Day? So, every day, you're like, Oh my word, it's the same thing. And you have kind of big expectations before you have kids. I had a list of things I was never going to do. Like, I'm never going to wear that, or I'm never going to feed them that, or I'm always going to... You know, you just have a vision. 

And then when you get here, the reality of they need to be fed and changed, and you're just kind of managing chaos a lot of your day. That was hard for me to bump up kind of my ideals and dreams of what I wanted to accomplish with the reality of like, I need to make it to dinnertime. [00:04:41] 

So maybe a goal is like, I want them to be a leader in their class and I want them to change the world or be a pastor. And then you've got that reality of like, I just want them to stay out of jail. Your goals just change drastically when you actually have humans in your house. 

So I think to find purpose within that thing, one of the things I did was I kind of got angry about it. I was like, "I'm not going to wait." So you could just buckle down and say, "Okay, I'm going to survive for the next 15 years and then be intentional. Or you could say, "How do I figure out how to have a purpose and be intentional during the chaos? So it's not like after. Because if you waited till after, they [inaudible 00:05:22] or they would graduate. 

So during the chaos, that was kind of how the book and my ABC Scripture Cards came about. I'm like, how do I do this during the mess? So if you look at Deuteronomy 6:7, it talks about that we teach them and impress them as we go about life. It says, as you walk around the road, talk to them about faith.

That verse gave me such freedom to say, that's my purpose. As I put them to bed, because I have to do that every night, how can I sprinkle in talks about how much Jesus loves them or who they are made to be and how much I love them. [00:05:55] That's how this actually become a time that I say, "Hey, let me tell you a little bit about your body and how you can protect yourself." Or "do you have any questions?" Or "Is there anything you don't like?"

So as we go, we are just having conversations. And doesn't that feel more doable to you to say like, I already have to do these things a hundred times in a week? I can just be intentional about the things they already have to do. Does that help at all? 

Laura Dugger: Absolutely. That's so freeing to not be adding one more thing to our to-do list, but really to maximize the opportunities in front of us already.

Courtney DeFeo: Yeah. I think it's going... especially if you've left a career, you can... and I left a big one. I was a Chick-fil-A person doing marketing. So things that you saw on your bags, decisions I made around the chain of Chick-fil-A, decisions I made, if I had a new promotion, it happened. If I had an idea about Cow Appreciation Day, everyone did it. If I had an idea about a billboard, it was on every billboard. 

So you go from that to being in a home where you're lonely and people are crying and fighting, and you're like, "Where's the promotion? Like, where's the glamor? No one's caring about my big ideas over here. [00:07:06] So it can be very deflating and you can feel very unheard and very unseen. 

So in that place, you're going, "God, remind me that this job matters and remind me that the decisions I'm making outside of the diapers do matter." And so it does. And so you have to continually battle that. 

I think that's why you see so many of us online if we're honest, it's like we're looking for affirmation. We're looking for someone to say, You matter. You're doing good. Keep up the great work. I think we have to be careful that we go, Are we looking for purpose in our starting our small businesses and affirmation and identity? Are we honestly looking to use our gifts to glorify God?

That is a thing I constantly wrestle with to go, "Lord, am I doing this for the right motive? Am I doing this because I really want to go after You and serve You or am I doing this because I'm feeling frustrated in my job as a mom?

Let me give you just two practical ways for purpose. Go back to your question. Okay? So in my little days, one of the things I saw was a really big opportunity that they needed me. I was like, I'm not just giving them lunch. My kids needed me to teach them how to play. 

And so when your kids are really little, do not underestimate that they literally don't know how to play. This will give you also relief to know at some point if you teach them how to play... and maybe some of you are rolling your eyes like, I hate to play. Well, I know. Some people are like, I hate to play Barbies. Yes, I know. [00:08:28] 

But if you teach them, at some point, they will play by themselves, imagine this, and you will walk away. There will be a time when your two kids will start playing together for hours and you won't even know what's happening. You're like, what is happening right now? I've been sitting here and they're playing and they're content. 

But it doesn't happen overnight and they don't have the skills right away to be able to do that. So one of the things I did is I created these little playboxes. We would get those plastic shoe boxes from Target and I would put in things. One of them was a hair salon. And I would just get stuff. They didn't want toy stuff, they wanted real stuff. 

I would get like a spray bottle, I would get like fake scissors, they're not real scissors, you know, foam rollers from the dollar store. I would get a comb. And they have held on to that play salon, I'm telling you, for like 10 years. And they played... They called it Hearts and Horses Salon. 

And it wasn't out all the time, but every now and then when they would get bored or I would get frustrated, I would go, "Girls, go get your Heart and Horses Salon." They have done people's hair for like 10 years. I mean, like grandparents, you know, when they come in, they're getting a hairdo. That helps their creativity. It creates their imagination to not pick up a screen to go like, I can create something. 

Another one was Play-Doh. I had a kindergarten teacher say, "I get so many kids that come in and they don't know what to do with Play-Doh." [00:09:46] Some of you are cringing because you hate the mess, but they need to know how to create something with nothing, to sit there for 10 minutes and do something alone with their imagination. 

That became a purpose. I have a role here. I have a job. I may not ever want to homeschool them, but for these couple hours, I can teach them how to play and share. You'll start noticing what they like to play together and you'll see these imaginations bloom and you'll see the leader... Always be the boss and the leader. And you'll see their little personalities come out. And you'll see them create worlds out of stuff. They need to be kids and to play. I took that role and that gave me purpose.

One of the things I will tell you, if you're not a player, find things that you loved to do when you were little or you didn't get to do so. One of the things I didn't get when I was little and I was kind of annoyed about it, is I wanted to dance for so long, and I didn't get to dance until I was like ninth grade. So I joined a company, I was ninth-grader.

I have always wanted to have been like a little girl dancer. So I kind of relived that for my kids. I put in a mini dance studio in their playroom. I put a hardwood floor down, I put a bar on the wall, and I bought a mound of tutus, and I put a bucket of dance shoes.  [00:10:55] 

Any kid that comes to our house, they love it. They will sit there forever because there's just like... what little girl doesn't dream of just playing dance? I think it's like I find that joy in yourself to go, What little worlds can I create if it's a science area or a... 

Like one year their whole Christmas gift was school teacher. I had so much fun going to the School Teacher Store and getting them. And again, not play stuff. They want real stuff. So I got them a real teacher's notebook and a real grading thing. I got some pencils with their names on it. And they have a real desk that I found on Craigslist, like an old school desk, like a metal one, and lockers. 

They have a whole school area where they play school. I could go on for days on that play, but it gets me fired up. So I have creative children now.

Laura Dugger: Oh, and you're so creative. I'm just sitting here beaming. 

Courtney DeFeo: The other one is Got gave me major purpose for my kids because I saw uniquely that, you know... and this is not rocket science, but hello, you were made to be their mom. And somewhere along the lines, I thought, "They respond very uniquely to me, to anyone else." [00:11:59] 

If I praise them, their hearts sit up straight. So I thought praise is another one that gave me purpose. And if they look in the mirror, they tear themselves apart. And if they go outside and they go into school, the world tears them apart. So I thought, my purpose has to also be... you know, and discipline for sure. Like that's a whole nother podcast. 

But our role is to teach them boundaries and discipline. But a big piece of our role is to build them up. And so I thought, how can I just... Again, you're like a student of your kid. You're watching them tick, you're seeing what they're good at, and you're pulling that out of them because they will start believing it.

Now, I told Ella for the last year that she was a leader... She's my oldest, and you could also say bossy, but she is a leader. I've taught her that over and over again. And about a month ago she goes, "Mom, I'm a leader." And I'm like, "You are. But I told her that and I prayed about it. 

I think it's just so cool this thing that your words are powerful. I would just encourage you guys today, like, you're not a babysitter. I know you feel like that some days, but you really aren't. You are a life-changing role model. And you have such power, such significant power. You're not sovereign, you're not Jesus, but you have such incredible power to change the lives of your kids. [00:13:20] 

My mom stayed at home with us, and I'm just... I walked away from incredible career with Chick-fil-A that I could cry about forever. But when I took my girls there last week, they went to Chick-fil-A headquarters, and I walked them around and they looked at me and said, "You left this?" I'm like, "Yeah, for you." Like two things I would have left this for and it's you two. I think they got the power of what I walked away from. There's just only a season you can be there for your kids. 

Laura Dugger: And I love it because it seems like one of your spiritual gifts is encouragement. Because you pour that out so lavishly on others, even through your resources, and it sounds like to your daughters. 

What a great practical idea to bring them back to a place that you used to work to show them what you chose as your trade-off to stay at home. But then you transitioned into a season where you also were starting to balance ministry and motherhood, and you did it in a way that honors God. So can you share how you did that? 

Courtney DeFeo: Yeah, absolutely. I will be as upfront as I can to tell you guys that this has not been easy. I get calls all the time, sit with moms all the time that are wanting to do this. I can talk to you both ways. So if you came to me and said, "I want to do this," I don't know if I could talk you out of it right now on this podcast. I could also talk you into it and say, "Go for it."

But the thing is, it is such a personal decision. So every mom I speak to, I say, it is personal and then it's seasonal. [00:14:50] Personal meaning God has to be leading this. If you think it's a fun idea to start a small business with small kids, think again. It is so time-consuming. 

Even if you think you've got the most simple idea, if you're like, "I just want to sell one t-shirt," well, the bank accounts, the e-commerce, the returns when you actually get real customers that are annoyed, it's like, wait, that sounded fun the first month, and then you have kids that are sick, like it's complicated.

So I could talk you out of it. But if God asks you to do it, just lean into that and remember that it could not be now. It could be seeding you an idea that's for ten years from now, and you're supposed to take one step and meet with one mentor. And so it's not an easy balance. 

But I will tell you, when they were home... We had two girls, back to back. They were like two and a baby. And I started where I had... you know, I could have been on Shark Tank. I always have ideas. So for me, uniquely, where it gave me the actual energy to go for it is when my passion and the ideas merged with a problem and a passion point that would impact my own family. 

So when I started seeing things then I was like, "I could use this for my kids. This is something I need for my kids," then I got motivated. And I thought with my experience with Chick-fil-A, I'm like, I know I could do this. I could totally do this. 

So then I took the next step and started seeking wise counsel and prayed about it. I didn't just haphazardly go for it. I prayed about it for like two years. So kind of held my gifts and my money and my talents with open hands and said, "Lord, if you used my talents to make people fall in love with chicken, what could you do with this to help people fall in love with Jesus? I'm willing, but I don't want my kids to fall behind the wayside." I kind of threw that out there. [00:16:35] 

Again, I'm in a unique position, and I want to be really clear about this because we are not in a position where I need to be an income driver. And that is a different position. So if some of you listening is like, "No, I need to have a side job, you certainly can still honor God, but your position is 'I need a side job'." And that is definitely different than what I've done. 

I've been able to, in some seasons, not blog and drop it for six months. And some seasons I travel and some seasons I don't, which is a super huge blessing. But also if you follow what I do, don't follow it as a recipe to have a booming business. You're like, "She's all over the place," I'm like, "I am because I'm able to have the luxury of making that decision. 

Because I think if you watch people and try to follow them and manufacture and duplicate, you got to be real careful because everybody's got... Like if you look at, you know, let's say Jess Connolly, she's an amazing writer, she's got a staff. It's awesome. She's got people. 

If you look at Living Well, Spending Less, she's amazing. But I met with her, and she's like, "I spend $4,000 a month on Facebook advertising." So she's got 300,000 Facebook followers and I'm comparing myself to her going, "What? I don't spend a dollar on Facebook advertising, nor do I..." And her husband stays at home. Just be careful as you're looking at other businesses and comparing yourself. 

So seasonal and personal, pray about it, and then take small steps. And also do your research because you don't want to get in over your head where you've made a significant investment of something you can't actually afford and it's not profitable. [00:18:21] 

There's some things that you're like, "I don't really care to make money, I just want to get this out there. But you can also get yourself in the hole of things that you thought were easy, but they're more expensive. 

You know, start small. If you think you're supposed to pour into twin girls, go start a Bible study. Don't watch a book. If you know you're supposed to write a Bible study, put it on a piece of paper and go share it with ten friends. 

Because of our culture right now, we have these big visions of what it's supposed to look like, and you just should start small. I started a little bit obnoxiously big. I was like, "Oh, I can have a product and put it all over the world." 

Laura Dugger: Let's get to your exact story, then. How old were your girls when you started doing anything ministry-related after you had held on to it for two years and prayed about it? 

Courtney DeFeo: They were two and four. I started a blog... I called it Little Light of Mine back then. But my big thought was, How do I shine my light and show my girls how to shine their light in a way that glorifies God? I wanted resources that were super practical for parents. 

I was seeing them in the church. I was going to North Point in Atlanta at the time and I was seeing them be super helpful on Sundays, but I didn't feel like I had tools during the week to do that. And so the first product I launched was ABC Scripture Cards. [00:19:37] I wanted scripture that I could put in my home, use at the moment, so when my girls were fighting, I would have something to use. I had a blog and I was writing and I thought, "Let me just share." 

Also at the time, I wanted real practical... just like we're talking right now. I'm like, 'I wanted not complaining. I didn't want all rosy and perfect. I wanted something down the middle lane that was like, I'll give you the truth. I'm going to give you hope, but I'm going to give you the truth." And so I started writing that way and always pointing people back to Jesus as the answer. I'll give you ideas because I love ideas, but I want you to seek God in this. That was my thought on the blog.

Then those ABC Scripture Cards, I had a feeling, because of my background, that they would take off, but in weeks I was selling a thousand, and then another thousand, and then another thousand. And I was like, "Oh my gosh, this was supposed to be like a side hobby." 

So that was Christmas. By the spring, they were on The View. Elisabeth Hasselbeck bought them, and she put them on The View as her favorite things. Then by that next month, Lisa Terhurst bought them and put them on her site. [00:20:37] 

So within six months, they went from like a little side mom project to a massive distribution where I was totally overwhelmed and crying and I was packing like... It was like I had child labor. I'm like, "Ella, get the boxes. Larson, grab the box." And she was like two. And I'm like making them not go to bed till [inaudible 00:20:54] products. 

So then you have a decision to go, what do I want most? Do I care about scripture getting in the homes? For sure. Do I want this everywhere? Yes. Do I want to be a millionaire? No. I want to be at their field trips, and I want to pick them up from school. 

I made the decision right then... They manufacture them in China now with a reputable, amazing place, and they're able to get them into stores through Dallas Market and Atlanta Home Market, and they get them into stores all over the U.S. I just get a check in the mail now for a very small percentage. 

So people are like, "You must be loaded." I'm like, no, I've never taken a salary in seven years. Never. I don't buy a pair of shoes. I just reinvest it into projects that I'm working on for my ministry. [00:21:40] 

But I just feel like that's a decision where people, you just go, what's most important. And for me, that decision was, "I just needed this to get out there and I can't keep up with it." So that is one product in the story of many, but well, just to give you an example of how you got to decide what's most important.

Laura Dugger: Yes. And that you had to reevaluate at different points because you didn't know how it would launch. And then it took off which people might be saying, "That's amazing. That's what you want." And it put you in this unique place, right? 

Courtney DeFeo: I will say, just like I said before, if we were in a different financial position, we may have done it differently. But thankfully my husband was going, No, I've got us. You stay focused. You've always wanted to be with the girls. Do not change." But if we had been in a financial straining position, I may have made a different choice. 

So I don't want to put guilt on someone that wouldn't have made that choice. Just specifically for us, specifically what God was asking me to do, that's what we had to do. 

I think that's the thing is we can't judge each other and just go like, Lord, lead me to what's the best thing and lead me to... I had another product called My Little Money Jars that I had to stop selling because they weren't doing as well. They were more time-consuming. [00:22:50] 

And the cool thing was I stopped doing that and I kept praying about it and I ended up using those products, which I so believe in, which helps kids with finances. I ended up putting that as a chapter in my book later. So everything He brings you through He'll use again. And even if it's a failure, it's like, okay, well, that was a debacle. 

So, how can I still use what I believed was something from Him but just in a different format? And be generous with it. Like I was like, Okay, well that didn't sell. Now everybody was ripping it off anyways on Pinterest. So like I'm just now load up exactly how to rip me off. So I'm like, here's the three jars. Here's how you get the labels and just share. Because you can't hold things too tightly, especially when it's just for the good of kids and families growing. It's like you got to go back to your motive and say, what is it really for? 

Laura Dugger: Oh, that's so good. And now a brief message from our sponsor. 

Sponsor: Today's episode is brought to you by Chick-fil-A East Peoria. Here's a few insider tips that you may not know about Chick-fil-A East Peoria. First, the best-kept secret is their chicken for breakfast. which is served Monday through Saturday, 6.30 a.m. until 10.30 a.m. 

My personal favorite are the chicken minis: four chicken nuggets tucked inside a mini yeast roll and then glazed with honey butter. Or you can try the egg white grill if you want to pack in the protein. 

Second, did you know that Chick-fil-A caters? They will deliver and set up all of your food for your event, such as your business meeting or your birthday party. There are even a few menu items that you can only get through catering, including the waffle potato chips and chilled grilled subs. [00:24:25] 

Finally, did you know you can skip the line and earn your way toward free food in the process? Just download the free Chick-fil-A app so you can place your order and pay on your mobile device, then bypass the entire line as it's ready for you when you arrive at Chick-fil-A East Peoria. For more insider tips or to fill out an application online, head over to cfaeastpeoria.com. 

Laura Dugger: This may be going on a little bit of a rabbit trail, but I was talking to my friend Rachel Allen this week — Hi, Rachel — and we were just saying, as the Lord brings these things to mind, and maybe you're starting a new ministry or a small business or something on the side that energizes you as a woman, as a mom, and it energizes your mothering, which do you see that cycle, which then in turn energizes your work? 

Something that we find crippling is a fear of, in 10 years, is there anything I'm going to regret that I'm not aware of now? Do you have any wisdom to share? 

Courtney DeFeo: Yes, having a third baby. I will tell you straight up. Okay, so if you look back, so they were two and four, I launched the scripture cards, I launched a book in 2014, we moved twice. So if you look at all that I really did feel like... I prayed. I felt like each project was brought to me. I felt like I was excited.

But it is hard to discern what is your excitement and what is opportunity brought to you from another person. I mean, God's not speaking out loud. So it is hard to discern the voice of God in times like that. Because you get kind of you're, like, the hot thing. You know what I mean? You're like, was that Him? Was that my agent? You know what I mean?

So you get in this pattern where your life is full and you can't figure out how to bring in another person. Ron and I would have conversations in passing like, should we have a third child? I'm like, "No, I don't know how we would do that. Because our second one was super reflux, colicky. I went into a really bad migraine cycle where I was sick as a dog. 

And if you looked at our landscape right then, you would say, I do not know how we would physically do it. With all that on the plate, it was like a no. Well, that became another year, and another no, and another no. [00:26:44] 

Well, fast forward right now, I'm like, Oh my gosh, we forgot to have a third child. And I'm mourning that now. I'm 41, I think. I don't know. 41. Ship has sailed there and they're asking. They're 9 and 11. I'm like dudes, it's too late We're like, there's no cribs here. We are traveling. It is like a four-man band and it is awesome. Like you get to the point where it's like, this is great. 

I think that's just one example of where you get in this motion and you're moving and you're busy and that you do get ten years past and you go, "Hold on. Should we have paused long enough and pulled up high enough that we go in the scheme of life, what matters? Could I create products later? Yes. Could I have children later? No. 

And you gotta pull way up and have hard conversations about what do you want your grandkids to know? What do you want your family to look like? I know people are cringing right now, but that's just gut-level honest. And I hope it helps one person to have another baby. 

Laura Dugger: I love that. That's so helpful just to have a real perspective. Let's transition a little bit to the family and home life that you're helping create. Clearly, you're great at vision-casting a home full of joy, and you're also able to break it down to a practical level. So can you share that vision with us? [00:28:09] 

Courtney DeFeo: Okay. I grew up in a Christian home. It was awesome. My parents were amazing. This is no fault of theirs. I always want to be clear on that. They did amazing stuff. But I think it may have been just the generation that we grew up in or the type of churches that we were around or I don't really know what it was. 

But somehow as a little girl and a teenager, I got the message that faith was rules and faith was bad stuff. I wanted to escape. So when I went to Auburn, I was like, "Pause on that because that's all rules and it's all the things I can't do." I wanted to go have fun. I just thought joy and fun and good stuff was not synonymous with the Christian faith. 

Then I discovered the complete opposite. When I got out of college and had my party years, I discovered Jesus again. I fell in love with Him. I was at a thing with Louie Giglio and just fell in love with the Lord again and I went on mission trips. And I felt Him use me and I was like, "Who left out this message? Like oh my gosh, it is so fulfilling to love God and it fills my soul to be serving."

I remember being in the streets of Ukraine on a mission trip, I was on staff at Chick-fil-A, and I was like, "Whatever this feeling is, being in the center of God's will, using your gifts and your talents and your time, I want to do this the rest of my life." And then when I became a parent, I'm like, "How do I get this message to them earlier?" [00:29:36] 

So a lot of what I do and write about is the idea that you can be fun and follow Jesus. You can laugh and follow Jesus. You can mess up and follow Jesus. The idea behind my book was if I got the chance to go propose a book at She Speaks conference with Proverbs 31, and they just said, If you ever were to write a book, what would it be about? And that idea came to me: In this house, we will giggle. 

And I thought, I could put 12 virtues in there by the month and show kids you can live a good life of biblical virtues, but how do you experience it in a fun way? I really wanted my kids to get this head knowledge of Jesus and bring it down into their heart in an experienced way. 

So we'll give some examples in a little bit but that was really kind of the vision for my home. It was like, how do I integrate their faith in a way that they're not memorizing it and marching along like little ducks, but they're actually getting the real experience that they go, "I like this."

Because most of our kids that grow up in a Christian faith will walk away from Him. And I just don't like that fact. I don't love it. I'm like, I'll do everything I can to change that statistic, not because I want to be a great mom and say my kids never walked away from Jesus but because I think it matters. I think it will save them from deep wounds in their life if they stay following Him for as long as possible. [00:30:59] 

Laura Dugger: Oh certainly. Your book was, first of all, incredible. I've read it cover to cover, loved it, underlined it all over. And it's a fun one that I'm gonna go back and read again and really focus different months on certain virtues. 

But something surprising to me was that I also grew up in a Christian home, didn't become a believer until after college. But I've grown up with some of these principles that my parents have taught me, but I was still learning so much myself. Even though it was a tool to use to teach your children, there was so much about the virtues that were new and fresh to me as well.

Courtney DeFeo: Wow. Listen, preach. I wrote the thing and learned myself. I think there was times where I was so frustrated and like, "Why am I doing this?" Like, "What do I have to know with two little girls? Why the heck am I writing a parenting book?"

Like I remember on the forgiveness chapter, I reread that chapter and it's like I don't even know who wrote that. So I asked the Lord, "You have to give me a fresh perspective because I don't know. I feel so inept, I feel like I have nothing to teach people, but I want so desperately this message to get out there." 

That one in particular, it was like a holy moment where God just gave me a fresh word. It's so fun to read because I'm like, that was the most fun typing because it was like He was just dumping stuff.

I told someone just before this call, a girl that's working on a book, and I said, "If you do it in obedience, you will learn more through just writing your own book about your own faith and your own journey that it's worth it." Like this is worth it for me to be able to learn what I learned about virtues and values and pass it on to my kids. [00:32:40] And if other people get it, Awesome. Am I a bestseller? Nope. But can I pass this on to my children? For sure. 

And we're still practicing. Like my girls are... if you come over today, we still have patience issues. We're still working on all of these. But I wanted it, just what you said was my goal, is that you would be able to pick it up in a busy season and go, wait, the responsibility is not really going so well over here. How can I refresh my heart on that? And how can I have a conversation starter and not feel like this is a mandate?

The only manual in your life should be the Bible. If this ever feels like a manual, then I've done my job wrong. It should be something that sparks a conversation or sparks an idea with your husband and he's like, "This won't actually work with our son, but I could see this working."

And it would kind of be this brainstorm between you guys to go, "We got to get creative about the way we communicate good things to our kids." Because if it looks and smells like a vegetable, they're going to run away. But if it looks and smells like a brownie and there's vegetables snuck in there, they're game. 

You just sneak it in there like it's an adventure, an experience, but it's like, Shh, don't tell them they're learning patience. It's like zip it. Just don't tell them and they'll have fun. They won't even know they were just on the adventure of a lifetime and they got Jesus all the way through it. Just don't tell them. [00:34:00] 

Laura Dugger: Oh my goodness, there is so much wisdom, so many things we could unpack in that. One thing that especially stands out, I love how you said when you're doing this in obedience. So if God has called one of these mamas to do something and it's a command that He is asking her, inviting her to obey, just like you did...

Now, I'm one of at least thousands of recipients of your obedience, the fruit of that. And then I get to teach my children. And so there is definitely a place and a need for these mamas to obey and step out. They don't know what will happen with it. So if it is from the Lord, I just want to encourage you today, move forward with that.

This is backing it up a little bit, but what were some of the real trade-offs or sacrifices that you did have to face while you were being obedient to take time to do this ministry? You had little kids at home. Can you share any stories of what that looked like? 

Courtney DeFeo: Well, I think the two that come to mind would be like, I found I sold the most when I would speak. So when you speak, even if it's one hour away or two hours, you're preparing, you're going. I didn't ever stop and go for an hour and now I...

I've never liked an experience with a speaker like that, that's like, I'm in and out. I'm like, I'm invested in your group. I'm going to talk to you. I'm going to hear your heart. I'm going to stand with you when you're crying. And all of a sudden I've been gone like eight hours and my husband's like, Uh, they just had a soccer game.

So there's expectations from the publisher that you sell a certain amount. I wanted them to be proud of me and I wanted them to feel like they invested in the right author that I would sell what they thought. They pay you in advance, upfront. 

So that's just an example of like when they asked me to write another one, my agent was like, "Let's do another one," my kids said, "No, I don't want that many babysitters. I don't want you to be gone that much." So I have paused on what the next thing is to write because I was like, "Lord, it has to be so clear it's from you that I'm willing to take some of those times away from my family. [00:36:07] 

The other one is the personal doubt that you take yourself through. Because it's almost like you put yourself out there naked in front of people and go, Look at all I'm offering. And you feel like a big nerd. There's a lot of good stuff out there. And sometimes some people do really well and sometimes yours flops and there's a lot of doubt that you put yourself through.

So you can do a number on your identity and your confidence. So that's a constant thing you have to keep going through. So be ready for that attack. You got to share yourself up with your identity in the Lord and surround yourself with friends that can keep you on track to go, Nope, you were told to do this, keep going, keep going. 

Then have a friend bold enough to say, "You know what, you are doing too much. You need to stop. Lysa TerKeurst has become a good friend and she told me a year into the process that "you can walk away. You've done your due diligence, you've done all you can do for the publisher, you can step down." And I was like, Oh, thank God. 

Now it's been a joy. Like when you call, I'm like, I love to talk about it, but I don't feel the pressure to talk about it. [00:37:10] 

Laura Dugger: Oh, that's so good. I love that because it shows God is so personal, and He's going to either somehow find a way to communicate with us. There's endless ways. He's so creative. And with you, He used a person that laid something out clearly, like, Okay, that was a good season. Because I wish there was a formula, like get a babysitter this amount of hours, and you won't regret it later.

Courtney DeFeo: And I would say just like we're talking now, like if you find a friend that you can walk this with. Lisa's been a good friend to me, but Jeannie Cunyon is another one. She wrote the book, Mom Set Free in a Bible Study. So fantastic.

But her and I went to Auburn together and we have walked each other through. I tell you, we're like on opposite days. When she's having a good day, I'm crying. When I'm having a good day, she's crying. But she's in Boston, but we can still pick up the phone and she will say, "I just opened my report on the number of books and she's like, "I'm never opening one again." We know the same business. 

If you are launching a product, find another friend that knows that world because your friends that aren't, they don't get it. 

Laura Dugger: Yes. Friends, accountability partners, people to encourage you. That's such a great piece of practical advice. We won't have time to unpack all the virtues, but could you just give us a little teaser of virtues that you cover in your book? [00:38:26] 

Courtney DeFeo: Absolutely. My favorite one and the biggest inspiration behind the whole thing is generosity. I don't think that every family is wired the same way, but just the way I was raised, my mom was huge into generosity, just the way she lived her life, and so that trickled down into my life.

And that's one that when you look back on my time and my time on this earth, I hope someone will say, Yeah, the DeFeo family was known for being generous. We started a random acts of kindness program called Light Em Up, and you can go to lightemupacts.com. It's on my site as well. But that was just a simple way. 

I wanted my girls to start experiencing how fun it is to serve. So when they were little bitty, like two and four, three and five, we started putting signs on trash cans and saying, thank you for picking up our garbage. We started putting notes in the mailbox. And I thought, Just like we talked about in the very beginning of this episode, what can we do right now and every day while we're between naps and between yogurt spills and all that, what can we do with the people right around our house to tell people that we appreciate them and we see them and we're grateful for what they do. 

We would sneak over and write sidewalk chalk on the streets and stuff like that. And that became a movement that went around the world. That showed me the power of Pinterest. It's like just step forward and start and share it with someone else and they will be so grateful that you have an idea that works. And it's been so fun. It's been so fun to watch other people take their own ideas and make it work for their families. 

Laura Dugger: I am so grateful again for all that you've done. As we wind down today, I've got one more question for you. And it's because we're called The Savvy Sauce for a reason, savvy means practical knowledge or discernment. So Courtney, what is your savvy sauce? [00:40:03] 

Courtney DeFeo: Okay, I would say friendships and relationships. We had a dinner the other night and we called it Board of Directors. I had eight other authors and speakers in the Dallas area and I invited them over and I said, "Ladies, we pour into people all the time. Do you want to come over for just a soul care night?"

Almost every single person cried their eyes out because we just said we needed to pause and just have a moment where we said, "What is going on? How are you? How does your soul feel in a time where you're constantly pouring out to other people?" And we just need that. We need a place where we can be safe. 

So I would say that's kind of my jam is to be honest and to get around people that are smarter than me and met when I'm messing up and met when I'm not okay and just love and be generous and open my house. 

There's a verse, a Message version of... it's right here on my wall. Matthew 5:14-16. It says, "Be generous with your life by opening up to others and you will prompt people to open up with God, this generous Father in heaven." I love to just start by opening up my life and then I get blessed in return. 

Laura Dugger: Courtney, you live that verse out so well. It has been such a joy and privilege to get to talk with you today and hear all of your ideas. And thank you just for being generous with your time and sharing with us today. 

Courtney DeFeo: My pleasure. Thanks for having me. 

Laura Dugger: At The Savvy Sauce, we love giveaways. So go on over to our website, thesavvysauce.com, and find our giveaways tab. There you can find the many different ways to enter for today's giveaway, which includes one set of Courtney's virtue cards, one copy of Courtney's book, In This House, We Will Giggle, and one set of Courtney's ABC Scripture Cards. 

Thanks for participating in this limited-time giveaway. [00:41:56] 

One more thing before you go, have you heard the term "gospel" before? It simply means good news. And I want to share the best news with you. But it starts with the bad news. Every single one of us were born sinners and God is perfect and holy, so He cannot be in the presence of sin. Therefore, we're separated from Him.

This means there's absolutely no chance we can make it to heaven on our own. So for you and for me, it means we deserve death and we can never pay back the sacrifice we owe to be saved. We need a savior. But God loved us so much, He made a way for His only son to willingly die in our place as the perfect substitute. 

This gives us hope of life forever in right relationship with Him. That is good news. Jesus lived the perfect life we could never live and died in our place for our sin. This was God's plan to make a way to reconcile with us so that God can look at us and see Jesus. [00:43:03] 

We can be covered and justified through the work Jesus finished if we choose to receive what He has done for us. Romans 10:9 says that if you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 

So would you pray with me now? Heavenly, Father, thank You for sending Jesus to take our place. I pray someone today right now is touched and chooses to turn their life over to You. Will You clearly guide them and help them take their next step in faith to declare You as Lord of their life? We trust You to work and change their lives now for eternity. In Jesus' name we pray, amen. 

If you prayed that prayer, you are declaring Him for me, so me for Him, you get the opportunity to live your life for Him. 

At this podcast, we are called Savvy for a reason. We want to give you practical tools to implement the knowledge you have learned. So are you ready to get started?

First, tell someone. Say it out loud. Get a Bible. The first day I made this decision my parents took me to Barnes and Noble to get the Quest NIV Bible and I love it. Start by reading the book of John. 

Get connected locally, which basically means just tell someone who is part of the church in your community that you made a decision to follow Christ. I'm assuming they will be thrilled to talk with you about further steps such as going to church and getting connected to other believers to encourage you.  

We want to celebrate with you too. So feel free to leave a comment for us if you made a decision for Christ. We also have show notes included where you can read Scripture that describes this process. [00:44:46] 

Finally, be encouraged. Luke 15:10 says, "In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents." The heavens are praising with you for your decision today. 

If you've already received this good news, I pray that you have someone else to share it with today. You are loved and I look forward to meeting you here next time.