Episodes
Monday Feb 18, 2019
Monday Feb 18, 2019
40. Meaningful Bonds Created Through Reading Aloud with Founder and President of Reading Legacies, Betty Mohlenbrock
**Transcription Below**
Proverbs 16:3 (NIV) “Commit to the LORD whatever you do, and your plans will succeed.”
Betty’s Mohlebrock’s background in primary education and nonprofit management has uniquely prepared her for the role of Founder and President of Reading Legacies. Her first nonprofit organization, United Through Reading (UTR), benefited over one million military service members and their families during her 20 years of leadership. Upon turning over the reins of UTR in 2008, she launched Reading Legacies in 2010 in order to reach out to children and youth who lack the emotional support of committed role models or whose lives have been torn apart by parental incarceration. Reading Legacies provides solutions to these devastating societal challenges through the transformational power of the shared-reading experience.
Direct Link to Book list (including titles mentioned by Betty)
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Gospel Scripture: (all NIV)
Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,”
Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”
Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.”
Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.”
Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”
Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.”
John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”
Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”
Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”
Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus”
Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession- to the praise of his glory.”
Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.”
Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“
Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“
Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.”
**Transcription**
[00:00:00] <music>
Laura Dugger: Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here.
[00:00:17] <music>
Laura Dugger: I want to say thank you to our sponsor, Peoria Christian School. They are raising a generation of 21st-century Christian leaders right here in central Illinois. Visit their website at peoriachristian.org. Thanks for your sponsorship.
Betty Mohlenbrock and I were introduced through a mutual friend, Jessica Hughes. Betty is the founder and president of Reading Legacies. This nonprofit organization serves children and youth whose lives have been torn apart by parental incarceration. She's going to teach us how shared reading experiences have transformational power. You'll also hear a few of her favorite book recommendations. I am honored to welcome her as our guest today.
Hello, Betty.
Betty Mohlenbrock: Hi, Laura. Nice to talk to you.
Laura Dugger: It's so great to have you today. Will you just start us off by sharing a few things about yourself? [00:01:19]
Betty Mohlenbrock: I would love to. Thank you for this privilege and honor to talk about my life and how the Lord is working through me. As I get older, I'm able to appreciate His work. I think that's a blessing in aging, if I might just add that.
My background, a schoolteacher and a family of schoolteachers, educators from Illinois, the Midwest, married a darling college sweetheart who 54 years later is still my college sweetheart. We came to San Diego 50-plus years ago during the Vietnam War when Bill was a flight surgeon. He had just finished his internship in St. Louis and we had a nine-month-old daughter and she grew up here. So she's really a pretty much a native.
So we landed here and we decided to stay because Bill's orthopedic residency invitation was here in San Diego. This has been our home ever since. We are now transplants into the San Diego community. [00:02:27]
Laura Dugger: Well, and it is a beautiful community. But you mentioned a little bit about your background. Could you share more about how that prepared you to launch two non-profit organizations?
Betty Mohlenbrock: Absolutely. Again, my genes were for teaching and loving children and having a heart for kids. My mother taught third grade. My dad was a school principal. So I did become a third-grade teacher after graduating from the University of Illinois for three summers.
After that, I went ahead and earned my master's degree in the teaching of reading because as a classroom teacher, I did know and observe the benefits of children who have been read to in the early years, the read-aloud experience, and became so cognizant of that, both, you know, hands-on in the classroom, then later with their own family and with all the research.
I did take time off from the classroom to raise our daughter, thinking we would have more. We had only one. The Lord gave us grandchildren instead, which is also quite wonderful. [00:03:32] But I decided then about middle school age that it was time for me to get back into teaching children. I had been tutoring children with reading problems, but I wanted to make a difference on a much larger scale.
And I know now that this was the Lord putting this in my heart to change the paradigm in our country. Huge, huge vision that He gave me, that children were missing this bonding and educational experience of adults, family members, and other close friends reading to them and spending time with them and talking to them and sharing their values. As I have watched our culture over the years, this continues to be a challenge for families for changing reasons, but the challenge is still there.
So the one fact that really hit me in the face... Well, actually, the good fact and then the bad fact. The good fact is that the single best predictor of a child being able to read in the early years is if they have been read aloud to regularly before they get to school. [00:04:38] Those first five years are critical.
At the same time, I learned only 50% of American children were being read to on a regular basis before they get to school or at all. That really broke my heart. Again, I think that the Lord... there's no way I could have done what I've done over the years without it being from him. And that is when I decided to start a nonprofit. That was in 1989.
At that time, I really was not a young girl. I was, to be honest with the facts, I was 49 years old and decided it was time to change the world. So if there are any women listening that are not, you know, in 20s or 30s, it's never too late to start something that you really feel led to do. So the rest of the story goes from there. It's been a wonderful, wonderful, wonderful journey.
Laura Dugger: Now, would you tell us a bit more about both of those nonprofits that you did start? [00:05:39]
Betty Mohlenbrock: Mm-hmm. In 1989, with my husband, who is a partner in everything, we have partnered with each other in our endeavors in many ways. I had this huge vision. I had never managed a non-profit organization or any kind of organization other than a classroom, which is challenging in and of itself in a different way.
So, we're here in a military community. I knew of military deployment causing a separation from your children that is really quite difficult, particularly for the children. We experienced that ourselves during Vietnam. When Bill was away for 10 months, our daughter didn't recognize him when he came back. Of course, in those days, there was no email, there was very little communication. But it was very impactful to have that experience.
So I decided I would start with military children because a vision for all children has to start somewhere. And that became a program that ultimately was embraced by the military. We worked with the USO, we worked with military commands.
I journeyed to Washington DC regularly on my own with the Department of Defense, with the Chief of Naval Operations, met with several of them, talking about how this small nonprofit in San Diego could help the military by making it a priority for these parents to read aloud with their children while away, but use technology as that connection. [00:07:11] On every ship, there is some sort of technology. In those days, just the video cameras, very minimal bandwidth for real-time. Today there are many, many other technologies available.
But what we learned is that because there were not a lot of family support programs in those days, now this was way back, almost 30 years ago, and this then did become something that the military, all of the commands now, every single military service branch is utilizing my program called United Through Reading, where they use technology to read aloud so that children can listen to mom or dad regularly.
And children love repetition, as anyone with children knows. So it's important that it be something that they can listen to repeatedly. The real-time is wonderful, but it is not something they can plug in when they're lonely. This is something that the child needs to have on demand. [00:08:11]
So that program became really pretty much running on its own. Target Corporation became our national sponsor. We partnered with the USO. It's just a beautiful, beautiful success story that the Lord rolled out with a lot of years and effort involved.
But along the way, I did look into how to reach other children and had programs for teens that are in at-risk communities, getting them involved as being role models, reading to children, rather than hanging out with gangs. That is a program that I brought forward from my old organization. Additionally, took the technology idea along with education, workshops, parent education into correctional facilities where we teach groups of parents the importance of being the first and most important teacher their child will ever have by reading to them.
Now we're breaking cycles in this community, the community where we're working with children of incarcerated family members. So much of incarceration is due to poverty and drugs. This is a way for us to help the child by helping the parent see that there are ways that they can change their lifestyle, there are ways that they can make a positive difference with their children. [00:09:27] It's very empowering.
So much of what human behavior is about is feeling that you can offer something to someone else. One of our core values at Reading Legacy, my current organization, is that you benefit, you grow so much when you're giving of yourself. And that's what we are allowing these at-risk parents, grandparents, older siblings, and the teens in our smaller teen volunteer program, that's what makes it work. The benefit is in giving to their children.
Laura Dugger: That's so great. Let's back up just a little bit. You might have touched on this point. When you founded Reading Legacies, why did you choose children specifically who have an incarcerated parent?
Betty Mohlenbrock: That's an interesting story. I retired from United Through Reading with the military program being so successful, a wonderful board, good staff. It was time for me to take a break. I guess I realized I wasn't finished with the vision because it was for all children, but I did retire. [00:10:32]
And then after about a year, the first organization came to me and said, "We are going to close the programs that you started here other than the military, would you like to do something with them?" So I came out of retirement to do Reading Legacies.
The reason that the program for the incarcerated family members was started was really due to parent workshops I had been giving through the Department of Social Services here in San Diego County, which now is Health and Human Services. The head of the department watched these parents responding to a very simple format talking about, again, you, the parent, are the first and most important teacher your child will ever have, and reading stories to them is how you can make the most positive impact in their lives.
Now, we were dealing with people with very low literacy, very little confidence, very little access to books in the home. So we partnered with libraries, we began working with these parents, teaching them to start telling a story from the pictures, reading the words that they were comfortable reading, and it began to interest them in their own literacy skills. [00:11:46] That was so fundamentally good.
At the same time, we were using technology with the military, and one of my knowledgeable board members said, "Betty, let's combine these two strategies and go inside correctional facilities. Because many of these people in our workshops in poverty were in and out of jail all the time anyway. So let's go inside where they have time, number one. Number two, they are looking for ways to change their lives." And this is the most fundamentally good way.
In fact, there are many studies that do say if you can connect the incarcerated person to their family, particularly to their children, they will do better when they get out. So we are basing our strategy on that as well, that this is a way to help them change their lives. So we went inside and in 2001 started that program in the female jail here in San Diego.
A little nervous about going into the men's facilities at first. But once we did, at the encouragement of the Sheriff's Department, we found that the responses were even more appreciative. [00:12:59]
You know, we go in as volunteers, and the message right out of the chute is, "We value you and your children enough to spend our volunteer time here helping you. We're not judging, we're not preaching." We're in there... It's really a ministry of presence. Someone mentioned that word to me that really meant so much, that it's really showing the Lord's love by being there and empowering them as a parent or a grandparent.
So that's why we did that. We felt that the children of incarcerated family members are some of the most vulnerable children in our country for repeating that behavior, getting in trouble, becoming incarcerated themselves. And so it seemed like the right thing to do. And that's why we're there.
Laura Dugger: Oh, I love your solution. And now a brief message from our sponsor.
Sponsor: This sponsor is particularly special to our editor, Natalie, because this is the school where her husband teaches and her children attend. Peoria Christian School grades Pre-K through 12 offers a Christ-centered, award-winning education for students. They believe eternity matters and so they want to share the importance of knowing the Lord personally.
PCS supports the Christian home and church by teaching from a biblical worldview. Their caring faculty and staff infuses God's truths through every area of the day, not just in daily Bible classes or in weekly chapels.
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Laura Dugger: From your experience, have you found it to be harder for children who have a mother that is incarcerated or a father or does it even make a difference?
Betty Mohlenbrock: I think it's difficult in either scenario. But I do know often that when the mother is missing that you're really going to have to come up with other family members. I think it's just a lot more logistically difficult. But as far as the child is concerned, I think it depends on each family unit and the dynamic there. [00:15:51]
But, you know, I would lean toward being more difficult if the mother is incarcerated just because of who's going to care for the children at home and all of that. Often a mother's bond is really the glue that keeps us all on track. So I would lean that way. I don't have any statistics on that, but I know that it's challenging either way.
Laura Dugger: And just in general, why do you believe reading aloud is so important?
Betty Mohlenbrock: Well, there are studies, of course, on the educational benefit of reading aloud to children, that it does give them that first interest in books, it teaches them vocabulary. In the early years, in the first few years of life, those children that have been exposed to language, have been read to and spoken to, have a much-increased vocabulary over children who have not.
The read-aloud experience is not only an educationally beneficial experience, but it's emotionally beneficial because it's a quiet, focused time, ideally, in the home together, sitting close, sharing throughout the story things that come to mind that are important to the family. [00:17:03]
And there are studies on this that it is, to me, it is also so emotionally stabilizing and the glue of a family, the glue of our society. When you think about it, it's the book, it's the good book where we find our bond with the Lord. And I think the word that we share with children, the time that we spend in good books, particularly the good book, is invaluable. There's nothing else like it.
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We hope you consider joining today. Visit us at thesavvysauce.com and click on our "Patreon" tab for more information. Thanks for participating.
We often envision reading aloud to children who can't read for themselves, but it may be helpful to expand that picture. Do you find it to be important for all ages of youth to have their parents read aloud to them? [00:18:25]
Betty Mohlenbrock: Oh, I absolutely think it's valuable. Again, though, you know, you don't want to force it. You don't want that to be a painful experience. But if it's a habit you develop in your family, and it's something that the youth, the children, and youth are accustomed to, I think it can and should continue as long as everyone still enjoys it. It's such a strong message. There's nothing like sharing a story, sharing information.
I just received a wonderful letter from my older sister about family history. I didn't want to read that alone. Of course, I did first, but I wanted to share that with my husband. There's something about giving and sharing and living experiences and memories together. I think it's always valuable. Yes.
Laura Dugger: Do you have any stories or statistics to describe these at-risk children both before and after experiencing your program? [00:19:25]
Betty Mohlenbrock: Oh my goodness, yes. Many, many. But I think the one that was probably most impactful was in the early years just because I was so alone in this venture other than with my precious partner, but I received a letter from one of the Navy wives in the early years of this program when we were still using VHS and we were sending the VHS tapes home through the ombudsman of each of the commands.
The ombudsman was like the point of contact for the family members if you're not military. And I'm sure I'm not defining that exactly correctly. But that's where the videos were delivered and then that person delivered them to the families. Now, of course, today it's way more direct than that.
But this mom sent a two-page letter describing how thrilled she was when she received this surprise VHS reading of her husband reading a story to the children and how much that meant to the children. [00:20:29] That her daughter had been wetting her pants, she quit that. She listened to the story again and again. She had to be in the hospital later. The other stories that came from dad on video, she watched that in the hospital and felt the comfort of daddy in the hospital with her. Just things like that over and over.
And with the correctional facilities, what we're finding is that not only the child who receives the DVD, which DVD now is what we use but the siblings, the whole family benefits. In one family, Friday night is movie night. They call everyone in their family. The grandmother puts out the phone call to all the family and they come over and listen to story time from their missing family member. It happens to be the mother of some young children. But just the whole bonding experience that we hear about every day.
We work in juvenile detention facilities where older siblings are taken away from the family and the younger siblings are very confused about where that brother or sister is. [00:21:35] So they read in our program to their young siblings and that allows that missing connection to be healed and not be so puzzling.
I think what's so different between military children and children of incarcerated family members is that with the military, at least they're proud of what their mom or dad is doing. With the correctional situation, it's very confusing. And children process things so personally. They take responsibility and feel guilty and confused. A lot of behavior problems come from this confusing separation.
And families handle it very differently. Some will not tell their children where the parent is. Some do. And I don't know the right answer to that, but I do know that across the board, the benefit to children is that it relieves that feeling of confusion, fear, and guilt. So those are the kinds of stories we hear, and it's unreal. It's really powerful.
Laura Dugger: That is powerful and transformational the power that it has from that shared reading experience. We love practical application here. So what are some options for the person listening today who is moved and desires to do more? [00:22:54]
Betty Mohlenbrock: You know, we're here in San Diego. To do more with us, the first request would be to pray for us because it's a big work. I don't mean to chuckle other than that it's such a big request.
In terms of hands-on involvement with us, I think the thing that we always need is books because we give a free book away with everything that we do. We do have a book list on our website that has been screened by our educational committee that reviews the books. So that is a way.
Of course, we welcome donations of any size because we are a community-based organization raising our funds from the general community.
If you're interested in a program like this in your communities, wherever you may be located, I would love to hear from you because our vision for both our teen volunteer program and our program for the children of incarcerated is to expand it and take it national eventually. [00:23:59]
I mean, that really is going to have to be the Lord's word, which we know it is anyway. But that's quite a leap. But we do have our first off-site program in Arizona. We're located in San Diego. And so, you know, we're learning, as we take it outside, how to make it easy to make this operable without being directly involved with our headquarters here, small office here in San Diego.
Those are the ways. I think, if you have book ideas, book selection ideas, we are always interested in that. We have a committee that's looking at books that teach values, because we believe that the books that we use are an important educational tool, not only for the child, but for the parent and or the teen doing the reading. We believe that when you read aloud to someone, you are also taking that into your soul, into your spirit. You're taking a lesson from that as well. [00:24:58] We do try to keep quality literature continually being improved upon.
Laura Dugger: That's wonderful. We will link to that place where you list all of the children's books.
Betty Mohlenbrock: Okay.
Laura Dugger: Could you also mention what your website is, a good place for people to get started?
Betty Mohlenbrock: Yes, it's simply readinglegacies.org. Readinglegacies is the plural and it's all one word. Readinglegacies, I-E-S, legacies.
Laura Dugger: Perfect. You're just a wonderful person to ask about a list of good children's books. So we won't go through all of them. But are there maybe three or four that you could mention?
Betty Mohlenbrock: Well, you know, we have favorites that really seem to be always popular. We do give a selection of books in everything that we do in these workshops inside the facilities. We have selections of quality books based on the age of the child. And also the illustrations because the books we incorporate do need to have illustrations for them to be attractive when sent via technology. [00:26:06]
Unless it's a chapter book and the child is old enough for that to be of interest simply with the words in the dad or mom's face. But most of our books have lovely illustrations and a lot of them are classics, even though we are incorporating new books. But I'm sure that your listeners will know Goodnight Moon with the Very Hungry Caterpillar and Rainbow Fish and The Giving Tree, Corduroy, Give a Mouse a Cookie, all of those that kids just love.
We do incorporate Dr. Seuss's books. A lot of our books have to be in paperback. Some that we might want to use if they're only available in hardback, then we cannot take them into the program inside the jails. There is a requirement that we must use paperback books. When you're working inside the facilities, you follow the rules, of course.
Those are some of the favorites. You know, Charlotte's Web, Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. All the fun books that have good rhythm to them, have beautiful illustrations, those are the favorites.
Laura Dugger: You've mentioned the good book, the Holy Bible. Do you have any personal scripture that's especially meaningful to you? [00:27:25]
Betty Mohlenbrock: Yeah, I have so many that I confuse myself often. But I think the one that I keep right here on my laptop is in Proverbs 16:3, Commit your work to the Lord and then your plans will succeed. That keeps me going every day, keeps me on task.
I also love the Nehemiah lessons on leadership, about leadership being something that always involves risk of failure when you try something. It requires hard work. All of these things that keep me going, that Nehemiah, his style of leadership that I have learned from in the Bible, there's no opportunity without criticism. You have to be ready to go forward and believe that you're doing the right thing. And there's no true leadership without trust in God.
I think that those kinds of things, as someone that has really I spent so many years now at the Lord's encouragement and empowerment in a leadership position of which I never would have guessed I would be in when I was a young woman. It's interesting how He has put me on a path that I would have had no clue that I could have done these things had I not given my life to Him. [00:28:53]
Laura Dugger: I love, like you, the book of Nehemiah. And you are just doing a great work. So keep up the leadership and the leaning on the Lord. Is there anything else you want our listeners to know that we have not discussed yet?
Betty Mohlenbrock: You know, I reflected with this opportunity to talk to you on what kind of keeps me balanced, for lack of a better word, because some days I don't feel very balanced. But I think what has been really helpful to me in my endeavors is to every single day spend time with Him, every single day spend time in His word as the first thing, my very first priority.
I also have found that exercise every single day of some sort, it's not fancy. Even going for a walk and talking to him. But moving and relaxing, letting your energy be released that way and also energized that way. And also making time for family and my husband. We are true partners and I think all of that has been the stabilizing force and influence that allows me to still be healthy, praise the Lord, and still be able to do His work. [00:30:11] I think there's a discipline to that that really helps keep us balanced.
Laura Dugger: That's so wise. Well, our listeners know that we're called The Savvy Sauce because "savvy" is synonymous with practical knowledge or discernment. So we would love to hear some insight from your life to inspire us with our own action item. So as the final question today, Betty, what is your savvy sauce?
Betty Mohlenbrock: Oh my goodness. My life is centered on relationships and spending time with others, giving of myself, listening to others, and being available. I just think relationships is what makes the world go around. And of course, the most important one is with our Lord.
Laura Dugger: Wow, thank you for that. I just want to sincerely thank you for your time today, Betty. You exude joy and your service is inspiring. So on behalf of myself, all the listeners, and the thousands whose lives you've touched, we just want to say thank you. [00:31:21]
Betty Mohlenbrock: Thank you so much. What a privilege. It was a joy. Thank you.
Laura Dugger: One more thing before you go. Have you heard the term "gospel" before? It simply means good news. And I want to share the best news with you. But it starts with the bad news. Every single one of us were born sinners and God is perfect and holy, so He cannot be in the presence of sin. Therefore, we're separated from Him.
This means there's absolutely no chance we can make it to heaven on our own. So for you and for me, it means we deserve death and we can never pay back the sacrifice we owe to be saved. We need a savior. But God loved us so much, He made a way for His only Son to willingly die in our place as the perfect substitute.
This gives us hope of life forever in right relationship with Him. That is good news. Jesus lived the perfect life we could never live and died in our place for our sin. [00:32:25] This was God's plan to make a way to reconcile with us so that God can look at us and see Jesus.
We can be covered and justified through the work Jesus finished if we choose to receive what He has done for us. Romans 10:9 says that if you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
So would you pray with me now? Heavenly, Father, thank You for sending Jesus to take our place. I pray someone today right now is touched and chooses to turn their life over to You. Will You clearly guide them and help them take their next step in faith to declare You as Lord of their life? We trust You to work and change their lives now for eternity. In Jesus name, we pray, amen.
If you prayed that prayer, you are declaring Him for me, so me for Him, you get the opportunity to live your life for Him. [00:33:24]
At this podcast, we are called Savvy for a reason. We want to give you practical tools to implement the knowledge you have learned. So you're ready to get started?
First, tell someone. Say it out loud. Get a Bible. The first day I made this decision my parents took me to Barnes and Noble to get the Quest NIV Bible and I love it. Start by reading the book of John.
Get connected locally, which basically means just tell someone who is part of the church in your community that you made a decision to follow Christ. I'm assuming they will be thrilled to talk with you about further steps such as going to church and getting connected to other believers to encourage you.
We want to celebrate with you too. So feel free to leave a comment for us if you made a decision for Christ. We also have show notes included where you can read Scripture that describes this process.
Finally, be encouraged. Luke 15:10 says, "In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents." [00:34:28] The heavens are praising with you for your decision today.
If you've already received this good news, I pray that you have someone else to share it with today. You are loved and I look forward to meeting you here next time.
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